Last week my favorite pervy dating site served up a man who could have been nothing short of spectacular. Recently divorced, he possessed suitable living arrangements, financial security, and all of his teeth; additionally, he could put two words together without criminal ignorance of tense and apostrophe.
Glory be!
In fact the final characteristic reported above excited me far more than any of the former. Nice cars don’t impress me much, nor do I require a potential partner’s employment to exist in the rarefied air of an upper-level corner office. Considering my work, how could I? But demonstrate the capability to place a semi-colon properly and my panties melt away like the flimsiest whisper of cotton candy. I’m so easy!
After the exchange of a number of emails — paragraphs long! with real information about who he was! and not just descriptions of how he’d like to fuck me any woman he could get his hands on! — I offered up the next step on The Ladder Into My Hearttm: the coveted IM handle.
Immediately began our first conversation, which should have been a pleasant back-and-forth information exchange, am I right? Isn’t that how it’s supposed to work? I ask you questions, you answer the questions, then lob back queries meant to elicit deliciously enticing information from my side of the net.
Unfortunately that did not happen. I lobbed — oh how I lobbed! — and he certainly answered my questions. He answered them and then wandered off on conversational tangents that left me more interested in the state of my cuticles than his next words. But did he ask for the same from me? He did not. Every time I interjected a plum tidbit about The Life and Times of AAG he dropped the metaphorical ball.
And it’s not like I made it hard for him! After hearing about his line of work (all about his line of work), I told him that I wrote and made websites. He asked for not a single specific; however, he did spend an hour volunteering details about the historical fiction he pens, during every free moment, in a tiny notebook, carried in his breast pocket for convenience, because he “just loves to create,” and someday he will be published, of that he is certain.
Me? Perhaps he assumed I write nothing more interesting than grocery lists. And perhaps he is right.
“I’m spending the evening working,” at one point I told him. “What in the world sort of writing must be done at 10pm on a Friday night?” should have been impossible not to ask! I mentioned the children I “bore or otherwise acquired,” which in any other human being would have set off a chain of questions designed to clarify that mystery. He asked nothing, choosing instead to prattle on about his children, who are, as you might have guessed, paragons of every conceivable virtue.
What say you, readers? Should I continue to allow this man to rattle on, or have we heard enough already?
This reeks of someone that is selfish and only cares about themselves. They want to talk talk talk but never listen. And in my experience, that selfishness carries over into the bedroom more often than not.
Please excuse my terrible grammar. Thank you.
Cut him loose!
I have plenty of online dating experience myself, and I’ve generally found that if a guy can’t get that back and forth down over email, it’ll only get worse in person. I’d say drop him unless you want a date where you don’t get a word in edgewise and hear all about how absolutely fantabulous he is (and how no one can ever keep up their end of the conversation) without getting a word in edgewise. Trust me, I’ve been there.
NEXT!
Another possibility is that his incessant prattle could be some sort of self-sabotaging defence mechanism; he doesn’t know how to relate and doesn’t want to over-step the mark by asking questions that are too personal so he talks about things he knows are safe (himself). Clearly he is a driven, passionate/creative individual with a dream. Given that he has been in previous relationships which have clearly ended (roughly?) he may have come to the conclusion that if others can’t love him for who he is, then at least he has himself.
The only way to find out is to force the issue and be direct – “I find your distinct lack of interest in my life and person to be disappointing, are you aware that I am flirting with you?”
Some people are clueless whether due to social ignorance or crippling self-esteem issues, of course both such problems might be deal breakers. It depends on what you are looking for.
I completely and utterly sympathize with you, AAG. The lack of reciprocity drives me bonkers.
The use of good grammar and spelling in a dating profile melts my panties, too. So much so, in fact, that I overlooked that he went to Oral Roberts University and said he was conservative all because he spelled “karaoke” correctly. As my profile clearly states that I am a feminist and a liberal, I was not surprised that my “wink” was not returned in kind.
In another case, it was only after entering into an e-mail conversation that I realized I needed to run away. I had been impressed by the length and breadth of his profile. Aside from not asking me questions and only answering my questions, he refused to tell me his real first name. He said he was planning on changing his first name to his screen name on his next birthday. His family and friends were having a problem with this idea, so he wanted any new friends to only know him by his screen name. He also refused to say what he did for a living, explaining that he would only say what he did if he needed help with something. //eyebrows raised// Burying bodies? Hiding the drugs? Calling the cops? Muse for nude sculpture? Fancy ribbon-tier? I’d prefer that a match come up with a clever euphemism for his employment (ex: “Professional Chicken Bather” for someone who fries chicken at KFC) than blatantly refuse to discuss his occupation.
rhetorical question right? :D
Yeah, AAG, this one sounds like a dud, sorry to say — and a narcissist, since he’s more concerned with himself than anyone else, including you, sadly enough. Either that, or he’s really, really, unnecessarily nervous. But I’d bet on the former.
Be done with him! He is extremely selfish, and thus would be a lousy partner in any circumstance, from dinner to sex. You deserve much better!
More than enough.
He sounds annoying, next.
All of what they said. He’ll probably be lousy in bed, which kinda defeats the purpose.
Move along, nothing to see here.
Personally, I hate conversing on IM. Find it very awkward and difficult to carry on anything resembling a real conversation. Since the profile and grammar match up with your desires, you might give some benefit of the doubt and schedule a brief phone call? I generally find that’s when I get my best sense of whether I want to go forward with an online someone … can get a sense of whether or not there’s even the chemistry worth pursuing!
I’m inclined to think the guy’s entirely self-absorbed, but Lisa’s got a point. I’m relatively articulate in some formats but probably come off as Mr. Incomprehensible in others. It might be worth giving him a shot in another medium. Maybe he’s great in Morse code?
So, I met this same guy once on Craigslist – or at least someone very similar (who was also perfect at semi-colon placement, as well as a host of other sexy grammatically correct functionalities – that shit rings my chimes, too!) and I, too, was wholly disappointed and relegated to cuticle inspection. It finally occurred to me to call him out on it – “Hey, what the hell? Do you have any interest at all about who I might be, because my threshold for listening to you drone on and pretend I am actually interested in carrying on a one-sided conversation has about been reached” – and to my surprise, he heard me, apologized, and began to ask questions.
Next thing I knew we were breaking up – 2 years later.
So, it might be that he is nervous and perhaps regressing, and is thus subconsciously reverting to that annoying schoolboy behavior, the one where he feels the needs to impress you with all that he does and has done (which, granted, may have it’s own further challenges if this were to progress).
I’d say call him on it – give him a chance to own his narcissistic tendency in this situation and see if he has the capacity to open himself up to you by shutting up and hearing who you are and what you’re all about. He may surprise you. Or not. But either way, there’s nothing to lose at this point!
Good luck!
xo~Sadie
Aahh yes.. and this could be the reason he is now a Divorced man. Although Sadie does make a good point, he could be uber nervous and would prattle on about himself in hopes to woo you. And thats what he did in his emails back and forth to you.
Perhaps email him and mention the fact that he made it to second base but he’s not paying attention to the pitcher who is about to throw him out.
As others have said, try calling him on it. Give him the benefit of the doubt, once. If nothing changes, you did give him fair warning, and time to find greener pastures…
But as others have said, the talking about himself could be unintentional. I myself swing from just asking questions/listening/divulging almost nothing, to excessively talking and forgetting to ask questions. So, I’m with the mention it first, and then drop him like a sack of potatoes if nothing changes crowd.
I’d agree with Sadie and others to have a phone call, call him on his lack of questioning and see what comes of that. If the instinct remains the same, cut him loose.
I dated that guy!
Just kidding, but I swear, one just like him. I fell in lust with him because he used juxtaposition correctly in a sentence. I’ve always that that is such a sexy word! Garrison Keillor’s got it right that the English major always gets the girl because he has so many more words with which to describe life.
Unfortunately, he also failed the volleyball test. I called him on it, he still didn’t have a clue and by then, I didn’t care.
Like the others have said. Call him on it. See what happens. Can’t hurt anything at this point.
I couldn’t tell you becuase that site does not any attention in my part of the world. DFucken boondocks.
And I’m in CA
Yer killin me. (sic)
I think this one deserves a big ol “buh-bye-now”
Cut him loose. I spent some of my best years (thirties) with his *twin* brother. What starts out being email and IM narcissism becomes years of one-sided relationship. One where the last year we cohabitated and I finally learned that his roadmap for our future didn’t even come close to my own. He wanted me to give up the fairly lucrative career I love, but still take a meaningless job with no stress. I would earn a pittance, be bored out of my mind, could be home to have dinner on the table and could take off work to attend his family and company functions on a whim. W. T. F? I didn’t work my ass off for 15 years to get where I was career-wise, with the end goal to throw it out and become June Fucking Cleaver.
I mentioned this recently in my own blog (which requires membership to see) that relationships are rarely 50/50 all the time. Sometimes they are 75/25 or even 100/0, depending on circumstances. The important thing is that the net is somewhere near 50/50 and no one party carries an unbalanced load for extended periods.
If this dude can’t even get email and IM communications right, it’s a huge red warning sign. I don’t agree that calling him out on it would get long-haul results. There is a reason that first impressions are important. Trust your gut on this one.
some guys, especially ones that have been in long term relationships that crashed, have a hard time opening up. I am not so sure I’d be as outgoing with every little bit of info about my life, but I’d certainly ask all sorts of questions about yours.
i’d give him on more shot and see how it goes. say something to him like “what’s the one most personal or private question you’d ask me, if I promised you i would answer it honestly without getting upset” and see what he does.
Have you ever read You Just Don’t Understand: Women and Men in Conversation? It sounds like you’re perfectly describing the difference between man-talk and woman-talk.
When men talk they don’t ask each other questions; they have instead a free flow of opinions, comments, facts, stories, insults etc. Many of us men are bilingual: we can do woman-talk, we can ask the expected questions. But many are not.
Regardless of whether this guy is or is not fluent in woman-talk – and whether he can be taught – it sounds like you are not fluent in man-talk either…
I have a large group of male friends — platonic and otherwise — with whom I can communicate just fine.
Odd, that.
That’s less a distinction between men and women so much as between the aware and the self-absorbed.
And that, my friends, was a Mansplaination!
Win!
A ‘mansplaination’ being an explanation about “something you know a hell of a lot more about than he does”?
What makes you put how men talk to each other into that category?
We’re not having a discussion of how men talk to each other.
We’re having a discussion of how PEOPLE talk to each other.
We’re having a discussion about how men talk, n’est ce pas?
I don’t care if I’m talking to someone who identifies as male, female or trans. If they never ask a damn thing about me, there’s a problem!
That’s entirely your call!
All I was hoping to suggest – as another answer to your question “What say you, readers?” – was that a behaviour that could be interpreted as a character flaw could also be interpreted as a communication style.
Of course, he could just be a jerk instead of, or as well as this…
It’s a self-absorbed, boorish communication style. It has nothing whatsoever to do with the person being a man.
We do not live in covens of women and come out, Jane Goodall-style, to study these strange and incomprehensible beings known as “men”. You do not have to explain them to us. We have talked to plenty of men who are perfectly capable of communication.
“A bore deprives you of solitude while denying you company.” – Giovanni Vincenzo Gravina
That book sucks.
[WORDPRESS HASHCASH] The poster sent us ’0 which is not a hashcash value.
It is funny how none of these “ZOMG men and women are SO TOTALLY DIFFERENT and experience the world in TOTALLY DIFFERENT WAYS!!!” distinctions ever actually apply to anyone I know in real life. It’s almost as though they’re made up!
Human beings all communicate through the same neurological apparatus. If someone is being an ass, it’s because this person is an ass, male or female.
The claim that men speak in men-talk and women speak in women-speak is stupid.
For one thing, it’s stupid to claim that even one person has only one discernible style. Even in a single conversation the current style of speech can change—it might open with exchanged queries about each other’s status or feelings, switch to an exchange of facts, then a debate, then conclude with negotiations.
I think that there are men who like to interact, and there are men who like to be interviewed. It’s harder to interact, because you’re essentially conducting 2 interviews at the same time. There’s also the risk of setting into the “and you?” pattern, constantly following up your question with the same one.
Personally, I like interacting, or at least being the interviewer. It gives me plenty of time to formulate my next thought, or take a long sip of my drink.
Asking the question is answering it. Is there any doubt that communication and connection is a two-way street?
My immediate response was to say “next.” But I think you should call him on it first, just in case. I was on a date once where I did just that, and he confessed that he thought he was supposed to impress me. Needless to say he gave me the best head of my life, and was never a selfish lover. Not savvy enough to keep long-term though, but a fun diversion.
Sounds like an obnoxious bore online.
But maybe worth meeting in person to find out. I don’t know why, but some people just don’t get how to converse normally on the internet. He wouldn’t be the first.
It’d be readily obvious over coffee if he really is that self centered.
In my opinion he’s not asking questions about you because he don’t want to be ask about himself. His answers to your question I’m sure is not accurate… don’t give a damn no more…
I’m a week late to this party, but I can’t resist.
What you have is a signaling problem.
Signaling is part of courtship. One thing that men and women signal to each other when they court is what kind of relationship they are seeking: short term or long term.
Men signal their interest in–and fitness for–a long term relationship (LTR) by forming an emotional bond with the woman. Among other things, this involves listening to her.
Men signal their interest in–and fitness for–a short term relationship (STR) by displaying their size, and strength, and–above all–their social dominance.
Socially dominant men get lots of women. Women who mate with socially dominant men are likely to have socially dominant sons, who get lots of women and produce lots of grandchildren. So there is selective pressure on women to choose socially dominant men for short term relationships.
To be socially dominant, it isn’t enough for a man to be big and strong. He also has to claw his way to the top and stay there. The necessary emotional makeup is arrogant and self-centered. This is what men display when they want to show off their social dominance to
a potential mate, and this is what women look for in a one-night stand. Needless to say, a man who is signaling his social dominance does not listen to the woman. It is–it has to be–all about him. Thus, the truism that “the jerks get all the girls”.
Anyway, back to your suitor. The problem was that he changed signals in mid-stream. First he listened to you, and then he didn’t. So you invested some of your time in an apparently promising LTR, and then you discovered that he was seeking a STR.
I don’t know why he did this. Maybe he considered the email purely functional (like an exchange of phone numbers), and only began his courtship with the IMs. Maybe he actually changed his mind in the middle. Maybe he’s too inept at courtship to keep his signals straight.
It could have been worse. The world is full of men who convincingly display their interest in an LTR–right up until the moment they ejaculate inside the woman.
Regardless, you now have the signals to know that he isn’t what you are seeking, and you can move on.
Good luck.
Interesting! Thanks, Steven!