Just before Christmas I enlisted the services of a sitter and headed to small claims court to ask for the money EdenFantasys.com failed to pay me for work I did in late September. I lined up with around one hundred other folks who were scheduled for an early morning hearing. I had no idea what to expect; I sat tight until I heard my name pass between the judge and a lawyerish dude. My ears perked up.
Soon they called me to the judge’s bench. The lawyerish dude had been hired by EF to represent them. He came prepared with a thick folder of papers, some of which he slid across to me. In approximately three minutes he outlined to the judge his objections to my claim, to wit: I sued the wrong person (Fred Petrenko, president of EdenFantasys.com instead of EdenFantasys.com) in the wrong place (my state where the work was done instead of New Jersey where EF is based) for work Fred claimed to have told me *not* to do.
No decisions were made; the judge directed us to come back next month for further arguments on the issues. I was stunned enough with the rapidity (and untruthfulness) of the proceedings that I failed to write down the actual date. I suppose I should call for it soon, eh?
So it seems that before our next date I need to be able to argue intelligently that I did indeed sue the correct person in the correct place. I am not quite sure how to go about doing this. I have the assurance of both the small claims court clerk and my divorce lawyer that bringing the suit here was the correct thing to do, but I’ll need to do some research in order to back up these assertions.
Proving that I charged for work he asked me to do should be easier. I have all our IMs and emails. Several of the writers I was working with have very kindly emailed me the details of our conversations, which I will show to the judge. And I have on my side the fact that Fred questioned exactly none of my hours until he fired me.
I found it disheartening to prepare for court and then end up with nothing accomplished. I’m completely frustrated at the idea of putting in even more hours in order to get paid by EF. And I’m livid (well, as livid as I can be while well-medicated) that Fred Petrenko continues to be untruthful about these issues.
Another person would give up this fight, I’m sure. I’ve questioned if I should. Already I’ve spent a couple hundred dollars in chasing the money. I hesitate to spend more. Certainly he’s already lost or spent more money than he owes me on his own effort, goodwill toward his company, and his lawyer’s time. Perhaps that alone should satisfy me.
But I don’t want to back down. I know I worked the hours that were billed. I know I did the work he asked me to do. And I know that I never sold links, as he’s accused me of doing. If I don’t hold firm, I encourage him to play these same games with every other person who ends up working for him in the future. I’d prefer that this not happen.
I sure could use some encouragement though. I don’t want to spend the money to hire a lawyer to sort through legal precedent for me. I’m going to have to do it myself, or else take suggestions from my lawyeristically-inclined readers. You know my email, right?
Also, I need some other advice. The opposing lawyer is mighty cute. Would it be wrong to flirt with him? A little? At the end of the case? I’m assuming Fred gave him this URL, so HI LAWYER. How you doin’?
Please advise.
I’ve never taken anyone to small claims court myself, but I did a quick Google search and turned up some helpful sites.
Here’s one: http://www.consumeraffairs.com/consumerism/small_claim_01.htm
And an informative article on eHow:
http://www.ehow.com/how_4687150_win-small-claims-court.html
I don’t blame you for not wanting to back down, I wouldn’t either. But don’t forget that your time is also worth something. If the second court date doesn’t show promise for your case being resolved in your favor, think seriously about dropping it. There may be other avenues to satisfaction, although probably not to the money.
As to the lawyer guy… after the case is over I think all bets are off, so go for it!
Defense lawyers are paid to do just what he did. Do not be disheartened. The start of a case is always kind of a “shot-gun” approach where they will throw every valid and invalid claim and see what sticks. The judge will NOT take what he says at face value. He (or she) knows the game.
Also, most judges are pretty sympathetic to pro-se plaintiffs. If you’re not going to hire a lawyer, probably the best you can do is be very organized, bring more than you think you need, and try really hard to stay calm and patient despite the heaps of bullshit. (Also, http://www.findlaw.com is a pretty good website if you plan to research yourself).
Ugh! Just wrote a long comment and lost it because I had Java disabled. Here’s the abridged version:
1. If you sued the wrong entity, it’s not a dealbreaker. You should be able to amend your original suit or file a new one. Worst case, you’ll have to pay new filing and service fees.
2. Do you have a signed contract with EF? Does the contract specify that disputes have to be heard in NJ? If not, then their argument about you suing in the wrong jurisdiction probably doesn’t hold water. They know you’re less likely to sue in NJ because you’ll incur travel expenses, etc. But barring agreements to the contrary, you should be able to sue EF in your state because (presumably) EF does business in your state.
3. Now is probably the time to let EF know that you’d entertain a settlement offer. Consider the total cost of this suit–unpaid invoices, court costs, legal fees, etc. And consider how much you’re likely to spend before it’s resolved. It it worth it to accept 75 cents or 90 cents on the dollar to end it now? Because EF surely realizes that its costs are adding up. Every time their lawyer calls or emails them, they are spending money. Every time their lawyer appears in court, they’re spending money. And if you stand a good change of winning this case, you can petition the court to have them pay your legal expenses (though your personal time probably wouldn’t be counted as a legal expense). So their costs are adding up, and now might be the time to settle.
4. Check out lawyers.com. It’s like findlaw.com, and has a ton of legal research and articles written for a non-lawyer audience. I’ve found it to contain really useful info for a variety of legal issues–tax stuff, wills and even small-claims court. You might get some good tips on there.
5. I know you were probably half-joking when you mentioned that the opposing counsel is cute. But at the risk of sounding like a killjoy, I would drop the topic. It hasn’t nothing to do with your case, but it still might get mentioned in court. Would you really want that?
Good luck!
Oops…knew I left something out.
Great that you have copies of all of your correspondence with EF. However, the emails from other writers probably can’t be introduced as evidence because they’d be considered hearsay, which is almost always banned. But it probably shouldn’t be necessary…the correspondence between the two of you should suffice.
Nothing to add advice wise, but I wanted to wish you good luck!
Sometimes you just need to fight because you KNOW you’re right. Also as a notice to future employers that freelance does not mean free.
Also, you might want to ask the clerk if you should file a motion for discovery, in order to get all the documents that the opposing lawyer intends to use in the case, and be prepared to give them everything you have in turn, or to file a motion to strike down his motion for discovery if you feel that turning over some documents would enable them to lie more effectively to the court.
I assume you already have, but if you haven’t, I would also look at the trial rules for the small claims courts in your state, in order to know what you can and cannot do in the courtroom, what sorts of motions can be filed when, and on what basis certain bits of stuff might or might not be admissible to the court, and the sorts of arguments that your opponent is likely to use to try and get the case dismissed or ruled in his favor.
You should probably amend your case by adding an additional defendant (Eden Fantasys itself), though you are not entirely out of line in filing a complaint directly against the man who signed your contract.
I agree with J about making an offer to settle, though it might sting your sense of principle.
I disagree about the other writers, since they are in fact relevant to the case, if i recall properly, though the fine details escape me. Regardless, it won’t hurt to have them.
Be prepared for the defense lawyer to object to your chat logs, as these are very easy to alter or fake, especially since your computer has not been turned over to the state as evidence, as it would in a criminal case. You can challenge him to produce logs for his client that contradict what yours say, and to prove that they haven’t been altered.
All I can think of at the moment… good luck!
Oh, and don’t flirt with the lawyer too much until the case is over. If he asks to meet with you to discuss settling, do it in a strictly business-like manner, if you can, unless he -insists- on taking you out to dinner. ;-)
I have no legal advice, I just want to be your cheerleading section. hehe
“Go ARG! RAW RAW RAW! GIMMA A A! GIMME A R! GIMME A G! A. R. G! YEAH!”
:)
Don’t forget, pain, suffering, log the time you spend organizing your case and seek payment for it as well. Then there is the mental anguish and stress this person has caused you and your family…..all in all you should be able to come out ahead as long as you do the work to go after it. It takes a lot of preparation, so work hard to get all your ducks in a row. And good luck.
“I found it disheartening to prepare for court and then end up with nothing accomplished.”
this happens all the time and discourages many people from continuing on.
i’m in family law so i hesitate to offer any advice on your particular situation but it looks like what other have said will get you far.
oh! and i vote for “flirt”. anything to trip up the opposition.
I have no legal advice either, but want to be with Sarah on the cheering squad.
H-E double L O.
We say hello.
AAG is here,
something to fear,
AAG she rocks,
right to the top.
We cheer to win
So now let’s begin!
Go AAG
I would also like to comment how MANY chants come up when you google ‘cheerleading’. Wow.
DONT QUIT!! you will always have the “what if…” syndrome if you do! :)
Hang in there.
I hope you (and like) Tom Petty’s song “I Won’t Back Down”. I’d keep it in mind:
Well I won’t back down, no I won’t back down
You can stand me up at the gates of hell
But I won’t back down…
I giggled at your Joey impression.
I’m going to disagree with some of the advice you’ve been given.
The problem with litigation is that most people make emotional decisions–not logical ones–when they are in the midst of a court battle. Sure, we all want to win. But how much is it worth it to you to win? How much are you willing to spend (calculating both your personal time and money)? In the long run, will you be satisfied if you recover the money but only break even because of the time you invested in the case? Realistically, what is the likelihood that you’ll win this case? If you only have a 50% chance of winning, would it be better to settle for a guaranteed 50 cents on the dollar than to have a 50% chance of winning nothing? If you pursue this case to its conclusion for nothing more than the principle of it, you may find that it’s ultimately unsatisfying if it doesn’t go your way. If there’s a way to conclude this litigation in a mutually satisfying manner, seriously consider doing so. There may be some tradeoffs, but it may be worth it in the end.
I also have to respectfully disagree with JL’s comment “Sometimes you just need to fight because you KNOW you’re right. Also as a notice to future employers that freelance does not mean free.” As someone who has both freelanced and hired freelancers, I’d shy away from litigious freelancers, and I’d never let my clients know if I’d sued another client. If, as a client, I knew that a freelancer had sued over an unpaid bill, I’d immediately ask myself, “Gee…what about her work was so bad that the client refused to pay the bill? And, I wonder if she’ll sue me?” Businesses understand that sometimes they have to use litigation to force another party to stick to their promises, but businesses don’t want to imagine that they might be the one that’s getting sued.
Another of your fan club
however a dose of reality, be prepared to give this up. The lawyers can and will milk this thing long beyond what is reasonable. Judges are not reasonable, if there is ANY question about ANYTHING they will simply dump it until next time, and lawyers can keep coming up with more issues forever. A friend took 3 years to get her divorce and spent more than everything in the combined assets on lawyers fees just to get a 50/50 split. When they want to be, lawyers can manipulate judges all they want. I have 3 separate examples from personal experience. So be prepared to make a logical decision at some point as to how far you will take it. Maybe SmallClaims is different though. I hope it doesn’t come to that.
See how the next session goes, you may very well end up needing a lawyer, there is a myriad number of specialized filings and paperwork and a lawyer can help.
Good example: One session was postponed for 3 months because the opponents lawyer claimed they never received a copy of the court transcript, we didn’t know it was on us to obtain them for both councils, then the next session was postponed another 3 months because the council claimed AGAIN that they never received it. We forgot to send it registered so had no proof it was delivered. Judge spent a grand total of 2 minutes, said reschedule and come back when all parties have paperwork.
It is the lawyers job to try and frustrate you and make you quit. If you quit, EF wins.
It is the lawyers job to try to get the case thrown out. The judge knew you weren’t prepared. TYhe judge could have decided on the objections on the spot, but (s)he didn’t. (S)he gave you a chance to get your stuff together and counter the lies.
It seems like the money isn’t the point. He is paying more for a lawyer than he owes you. When you win, expect an appeal. Research the next step, so you are ready for it. And for every dollar you spend for time time and a sitter, he is probably spending 5 to 7. When you quit because it isn’t worth the cost think about what you are saving him.
A lawyer will probably want a cut of the settlement. That means even less of the money you are owed making it to your pocket. Small claims is the right path.
“Be without fear in the face of your enemies. Be brave and upright that God may love thee. Speak the truth always, even if it leads to your death. Safeguard the helpless and do no wrong.”
I’m totally not a lawyer, but I have beaten a speeding ticket, the best resource was having watched “The Practice” of all things.
However, for a more serious issue, I hired a lawyer. Do you know what I learned? The process is more expensive, drawn out and emotionally distressing WITH an attorney representing you.
I have a cousin who is a lawyer, and he’ll be the first to tell a family member that their purpose is to generate as much “stuff” as possible, the more complex/cluttered/obscured the situation, the less chance of a clear loss (and the more billable hours spent “working” on a case).
Court is also NOT a business. They do not want to “get things accomplished” like businesspeople do. What can be accomplished with a few phone calls courts will spend months rescheduling.
So their entire purpose is to dishearten you. From the tone of your post, it sounds like they partially accomplished their goal and have nearly won! Just a few more court dates and you might be willing to throw in the towel and settle.
I wouldn’t offer to settle yet however, as what is there view? The feedback their lawyer gave? “She was unprepared, she doesn’t know what she is doing, she doesn’t have a chance, we’ll get this kicked.”
Meanwhile, your feedback to your client after court might be, “They tried a specious claim that we should have sued elsewhere, they tried thing irrelevant to the facts of the case, they are drawing at straws and have no case.”
Also, for any statements you have from people who are willing to have them notarized, that might help their legitimacy?
Finally, don’t expect anything more to come from the next court date either. You’ll probably be prepared for what came up last time, that might barely be touched upon while they pull out the next “issue” and rinse and repeat.
When their attorney runs out of things to pull out and it starts to come down to dealing with reality, then would be the time to talk about settling I would imagine.
IE, you need to be in a position of strength, where they are worried about a greater cost instead of “a few more court dates and she’ll be done”.
Good luck!
Only wrong if you don’t wait until after your case is finished/etc.
I am a lawyer, and the only advice you need from me is to listen to J.
The important question first – Yes! Flirt with the good looking lawyer! Probably won’t help your case, but you’re both there . . . so . . .
As for the legal stuff, J is right. I’ve been involved on both sides of a lot of copyright disputes (nature of the business) and cases are often abandoned or illegit cases settled because sometimes they amount to throwing good money after bad.
I have a song that was used illegally in an independent film about a year ago. My lawyer told me I would definitely win the case . . . and lose money overall in the process. It pained me to let it go, but ultimately “teaching a lesson” to one guy at my expense wasn’t worth it.
That’s not to say you should throw in the towel, just that it’s important to keep perspective.
Gee, that entry didn’t have hardly anything about sex in it.
Tomorrow is about fisting. Does that help?
:)
I swear, this has to be the best blog that I have ever read.
I’m no lawyer, so I’ll be in the cheerleading crowd… then again, I’m not cheerleader D:
Anywho, can’t wait for tomorrow >O>
No advice from me, just saying how much this sucks. Ugh.
I do hope nothing like that happens to me in the future, because I like what I do there (so far). I’m only a reviewer for EF, but it bugs me that the owner himself is pulling this crap on you. Makes me feel bad for working with them… >.<
Lots and lots and lots of luck, we’re all behind you.
<3
Sin
Thanks Sin.
I don’t blame anyone for working for or with EF. Lots of people have had great experiences with the company. Just wish mine had ended better.
:)
In my state, litigants are not allowed to be represented by attorneys, so I’m kind of thrown right there.
However, with all due respect to the real lawyers who are commenting, I would keep going with it on your own. If the emails between you say what you read them to say, they should hold water. Plus there seems to be a David v. Goliath vibe here that I can’t help but think swings in your favor.
In my small claims case, I was fortunate that the judge allowed the defendant to speak first and loudest, and he talked himself right into a verdict against him.
To reiterate some of the advice you’ve heard:
It sounds like your main problem is that you may have sued the wrong entity – you probably should have sued the compnay not the owner. However, you should be able to add the company (perhaps ask the clerk) or at least, file again if you lose at the next round.
You should take heart from the fact that you don’t have to pay a lawyer, and so the suit may be worth it, and secondly, you are forcing him to pay a lawyer, probably for more than is at stake. If you are so inclined, contact the lawyer and offer to settle for two thirds of what you are owed (remembering that even if you win, it may be difficult and/or expensive to actually collect on your judgment.)
So it seems that before our next date I need to be able to argue intelligently that I did indeed sue the correct person in the correct place.
When I worked as an independent contractor, I encountered a similar situation with a client who owed me a substantial sum. Based on that experience, I think J’s comment succinctly outlines your next step(s) in this dispute. A business agreement or letter of understanding signed by both parties usually specifies where disputes will be adjudicated, your state or that of the other party.
If I don’t hold firm, I encourage him to play these same games with every other person who ends up working for him in the future. I’d prefer that this not happen.*
I disagree, aag.
As one client said to me, “If you are serious about success, you can’t afford the luxury of a grudge.” Your reputation in business rests upon your ability to form and maintain good working relationships. All business transactions are subject to misunderstanding. That’s why we have small claim courts. A written business agreement cannot cover all possible areas of dispute.
As for pursuing this claim to discourage the other party from “playing games” — here you are confusing a business transaction with advocacy for social justice. I think both you and your former business client have learned from this experience. So cut your losses now. J’s suggestion that this is an opportune time for both parties to consider a settlement offer is sound advice.
If I could offer a moral to this story, as in the famous Fractured Fairy Tales, it would be this:
Hold firm in bed. Be flexible in business.
Know that I wish you the best.
Your mother would be so happy if you married a lawyer! It would almost make up for the, you know, godlessness of sexing and all…
Sooo many good things can come out of your court dates.
You know, I never thought of that!
Hi AAG,
I’m in law school, and while my real world experience is quite limited, J really hit the nail on the head with her advice. A local law school will probably be able to give you free legal counsel, or at the very least, any local library will likely have resources on basic civil procedures.
In all seriousness, if this ends up geographically relocating to the source of the issue and you still want to pursue it, you have a couch, a home cooked meal, and a ride waiting for you if you need to come this way.
You go girl.
Thank you so much, honey. I do appreciate the offer. –aag
Sorry, no lawyers available here. I don’t know your full situation since I started catching up with your from only the beginning of this year. I’m sorry you are in such an ugly spot. Hope it all works out for you!
This is so disheartening. I’ve been so let down lately by people who have approached me with business ideas and money making opportunities. This only reinforces my lack of trust… I hate having my time wasted by thoughtless, insensitive scoundrels!
Thank you for sharing this invaluable info.
I wrote it because I didn’t want anyone else to get burned the way I was. Hope it helped.