I suppose I could have steered him in a completely different direction, but that seemed pointless and cruel.
He wanted a vibrator, he told me, as his wife had a hard time getting interested in sex. Fingers poised over the keys, I was set to launch into a litany of questions so as to narrow down exactly which sort of vibe they might find attractive, but his next message popped onto the screen before I could start.
She’d been experiencing a very dry vagina, he told me, ever since she began menopause — some fifteen years ago. Because of that, they’d not had sex in a very, very long time.
I let him type on. Price would not be important, he said, if only he could find something that would work, but he’d struck out with all the other vibrators he’d tried to introduce to his wife in the past. He was hoping that I could suggest some “better” vibe that would entice his wife.
Fifteen years of menopausal dry vagina, a toy box full of vibes which had failed to produce results, no sex for a long time, and he wanted a solution. From me.
This is the sort of contact that worries my brain the most. It worries me more than the contacts from dudes who want me to cyber with them, or explain to them in prurient detail how to use a male masturbator, or baby-step them through pegging.
It worries me more than people who are cranky because a credit card was declined, or churlish because a toy died an untimely death, or crestfallen because a love doll can’t be delivered before the weekend.
It’s the sort of contact that worries me because I feel his pain, even through a sketchy internet connection. Or, you know, maybe I’m just projecting. I’ve certainly been there, in the place where nothing you do brings any change in a sexual dynamic that’s built up over months and years, and where every suggestion is met by blazing disdain or frosty indifference.
So when he asked me for the latest in vibratory technology, I just couldn’t give it to him. I suggested a cheap but infallibly effective vibe and some really good lubes. I all but demanded that they consult a doctor for other alternatives, alternatives that would have been inappropriate for a mere toy rep to mention.
But he told me that she didn’t like using lube because it made her “feel old.” She wouldn’t speak to her doctor because this was a “private matter.” She refused to consider prescription or non-prescription menopausal remedies because they “weren’t natural.”
Then give up, I wanted to tell the man (but didn’t). Cease your efforts. You are wasting your time and hers.
Sounds harsh, but it might have been the kindest thing he could have heard.
Give up and do what? He’s married. He doesn’t have any choice but to keep trying.
Is it appropriate to divorce someone just because the sex isn’t there? Even if the rest of the relationship is good?
No lube because it makes her feel old?
Maybe that’s a place to start- making lube a fun, positive thing in her eyes rather than a stigma. I’m 23 and I love lube…because it’s awesome. If he can help her see the lube in another light, I’m guessing all those amassed toys might just be able to gain a whole new life.
I’m on Kuri with this. She’s not offering any solutions..
it’s making me wonder whether she cares about her husband or not, because you figure she’d at least try.
Ditto to what Kuri said.
I’ve been using lube since I started having sex at 18! It’s not an ‘old person’ thing. It makes sex a lot more pleasant, slippery and fun!
It helps with toys too!
This is the sort of contact that worries my brain the most.
I beg to differ.
The contacts you should worry about will be on the dating sites pretending to be single. They will be seeking that “special someone” with whom they will make the same old mistakes that plague their doomed marriages.
ditto, ditto, lube is sometimes essential, and always fun. Thanks for the fleshbotting dearheart.
Lube is awesome! Best lube: OPJ (other people’s jism). Sloppy seconds – nothing like it! Kinky? Yeah, but don’t knock it till you try it!
Oh, and I almost forgot, it’s natural, not man-made.
If someone has a biological need for something then that issue needs to be addressed regardless of any other factor. There are many factors for getting into a marriage: Social, Sex Life, Money, Romance etc.
However, if one fails then the supports holding up the bridge between the two couples falls down. The end result is depression.
I think this woman was hiding something.
Remember in the “Filler” episode of Friends where Ross didn’t have sex with his girlfriend for a month. The scenario was that she is a lesbian but, didn’t realize it yet.
His wife’s just making excuses – she just doesn’t want the slightest intimate contact with him. I’ve just been through a divorce that had that as one of its long term issues. She’ll never voluntarily be intimate with him ever again, it strikes me, and he should give up all hope of it as she defiantly refuses to take any steps to address the issue. He has my heartfelt sympathy, but he needs to accept the reality of his unfortunate situation.
On a lighter note ‘pegging’ had me dashing to http://www.urbandictionary.com/ ;o)
He needs to use something like Kama Sutra masage oil which doubles as a decent lube.
He starts with a wonderful massage for her and before he knows it, he’s sliding it home in oily comfort.
ouch
would that if i ever get that uninterested i have the balls to leave first.
Speaking from personal experience, a vaginal moisturizer is more beneficial. Replens is used one as week and leaves you always ready. Walking around with a wet pussy tends to focus one thoughts on sex.
I like Lub there is nothing wrong with that
You can’t help someone that refuses to help themselves. Obviously this woman has no interest in sex. You did what you could and that’s all you can do.
Lube makes her feel old? I’m thinking it would be the dry vagina that would do that. Or the crap attitude. Or the fact that she’s not getting any.
I can’t help but wonder what their sex life was like before menopause if she can’t even talk to the doctor about it.
How sad.
There was a radio show on this morning with just the same issue, but the wife was saying she would not use lube because it is not ‘natural’. I think it is either an excuse and allows her to back away with out saying she is not interested anymore, or it is just ignorance. Surely lube is a standard equipment in a modern healthy sex life.
I don’t think he has a chance there … if you can’t make it work with a basic uncomplicated vibe, then nothing else will do it.
This story really saddens me… I admire this guy for not leaving her, he must love her a lot.
I hope they figure it out.
This is a sad story and people should not be too hard on the wife about this. Hormone balances change and women can easily just not be in the mood. Once that happens, then she has to force herself to be intimate as her “wifely duty” but that only lasts so long.
You would think she would be eager to try each and every thing possible but hormonal changes many times render the woman uninterested.
I think his best bet would be to do the massage oil route and do some manual stimulation with an oily finger or two to lubricate things without having to say “honey, want me to use some lube?” but he has to accept that she may be completely uninterested. One last medical thing, if she has checkups, have her checked for testosterone levels. Low levels (in women) are frequently unchecked and unnoticed and have a profound impact on sex-drive.
On a different note, think how wonderful that this person writes you out of the blue, using your blogs as source material so he feels comfortable about asking you such sensitive questions. It shows how much of “you” comes across in your writings!
He wrote to me when I was working over at EdenFantasys. He didn’t know me from the blog.
:)
I feel his pain. I’m there. Not quite as extreme, but it’s all familiar.
Where trying to move off dead center sexually is met by blazing disdain or frosty indifference. Where she wants to get our lovemaking over with as fast as possible.
Where even asking “Why do you seem to enjoy fucking, but don’t want to seem to do it frequently?” leads to an hour of furious, inexplicable defensiveness.
Where things make her feel old or unnatural. Where the doctor says it’s to be expected.
For me the real pain in the book I’d Rather Be Eating Chocolate is with the husband. Sleeping next to someone who you totally get off on, but who is largely disinterested. Someone who was sexually open for years when you met (25 years ago), but through time and familiarity and menopause or something is no longer is even really interested.
And I, like him, keep looking for the miracle cure: liberation for her in a new approach by us, a new approach by me, a new skill from me, in a toy, a book, a DVD, anything. Nothing either works, or is tried, or is even considered. To her everything’s fine. (Alanis Morissette’s song, “Bent for You”, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYaGP4cNHJ0, comes to mind.)
I keep having this feeling, if only we did… or she tried… or I was… or I gave her… she would open up again — that there’s some magic that will transform everything.
Like some “male menopausal” men, I have gotten very interested in all kinds of kink and experimenting that she, of course, doesn’t even want to hear me mention. For example, she claims that she has no sexual fantasies. The fact that she even classes fantasies as kink is revealing. She either is uninterested or repelled by anything else.
We’re stuck. I’m stuck. I don’t know how we got this place. I don’t know how we’re going to get out of this place.
And I keep fighting, Cease your efforts. You are wasting your time and hers. But I’m sure you’re right.
Maybe my unwillingness to even contemplate breaking up is equivalent to her unwillingness to even consider changing our sexual dynamic?
Slow Learner is right. It’s not about the lube.
And yes, Sem, divorce is perfectly ok in such a situation. As a practical matter, if the sex is this big a problem, the rest of the relationship isn’t great.
Pegging?
Pegging…look here –aag
I feel bad for Sometimes heartbroken – I know what it’s like, though, to be a wife who is sort of in that situation. The hubby and i have been together for 8 years and I go through long periods where I don’t want sex at all. I feel guilty, though, and wind up giving a blow job or something.
With me, I think, a few things factor in – hormones, definitely, are part of the problem, but also how we connect. We recently went through a very difficult time where he wasn’t connecting with me and wasn’t there for me – he didn’t even know that I needed him there for me. Women sometimes have a hard time expressing what we need – like we want our men to be sort of psychic and to be able to figure out what we need…I know…we’re all a bit loony LOL.
best wishes to you and your wife, though – I hope you get through it.
Oh, that post made me feel so sad. Because…it seems like such a common problem. I know couples like that – my in-laws are a couple like that. And I wish they could realize how much fun they could be having, how much better it could be for them! It just makes me so sad for them.
That marriage is over.
It is very clear from your description. She doesn’t want to even try. It’s not about the vibes, or the lubes. She doesn’t want sex, and she doesn’t WANT to want sex! It’s so obvious.
I went through this with my ex. She not only didn’t like sex, she didn’t like being aroused. When I did manage to get her aroused, she found it an annoying sensation, and wanted to hurry up and have sex ASAP so as to be rid of it. She resented it whenever I did manage to turn her on. It screwed up her plans; threw of her schedule. She hated being seduced. Sex was an action item, very low on the priority list, and to be completed only in a well-planned time and location.
Am I bitter? Yes, I’m bitter.
But getting her to try anything was like pulling teeth. She just didn’t want to know about it. And, back to my point, she didn’t WANT to want to know about it. That’s a critical distinction and that’s certainly what I’m hearing through your description of your conversation about this gentleman’s wife.
He should leave immediately. That’s not a marriage, it’s a friendship, at best.
Lucky woman… my ex husband felt so threatened by my toys he took to hiding them on me in his golf bag. Hence the phrase EX husband.
That being said, this woman needs a reality check. Because if she is “too young” for lube, “too insecure” to go to her Dr. and won’t use remedies because they are “unnatural” she’s crazy. Has she seen the things they use to preserve our food for the grocery stores? Talk about unnatural.
Personally, I think she is just making up excuses NOT to have sex with her husband. Perhaps he should stop wasting his and her time.
A wife who cared about their sex life would seek whatever means possible to remedy this. Or would find alternate means (ie:lube).
This is one thing I really hate. Is when people treat sex like it is such a closeted issue. Sex is a perfectly natural thing and we all do it, some of us do it with multiple partners, and that’s not to go into all of the fetishes. She is a grown woman, and if she goes in for her annual physical and PAP as all women should, she could just mention it at that point.
I feel sad for the guy but the wife makes me angry. The trivial, curable things people will allow to ruin their sex life! And people wonder why their spouses are driven to cheat.
I mean come on, a few moments of discomfort explaining the problem to her Dr. could end up with the return of a fulfilling sexual relationship with her husband. What is more important here?!?
Situations such as this sadden and frustrate me as well. I don’t blame you for feeling like giving up. You are being real with your feelings when you say that. Let’s get real here people….growth with sexuality is the same as growth in any other area of our lives….it needs conscious effort and willingness to happen, as well as hell of a lot of patience and empathy. This is not a quick fix that a vibrator or a bottle of lube can fix.
My suggestion would be to encourage him to look at it from a different perspective. Instead of trying to get her interested in sex again, encourage him to try and get that vagina and mind of hers wet again by figuring out what she wants and then give it to her. I know its not simple although it is a simple concept. I do believe sex is 90% fiction and 10% friction. Her mind and heart need to be engaged first before she can reconnect with her body and get turned on. I would encourage him to have a hell of a lot of patience and to reconnect with his romantic side. He needs to help her get what she needs, not what he thinks she needs.
Just some thoughts from a sex worker who also use to work in the counseling psychology field for 6 years.
-Tess
Another reason why I’m not buying the whole “dry vagina” ruse:
What, does menopause give you dry mouth too? What’s wrong with her mouth? What’s wrong with HIS mouth?
Oral sex is a higher form of sex, a better orgasm, and I find it more intense and loving and hot than in-and-out intercourse. So why not enjoy that? What does a dry vagina have to do with it? Nothing.
This woman does not want to be married– at least not to this guy. That’s all there is to it. He should get out now. It’s over.
Also, first it was Mr. Smooth Vagina (great band name!) and now it’s Dry Vagina (also a good name for an all-grrl menopausal punk band). If this continues, then maybe this blog could be sub-titled: “The Vagina Textures”.
So sad and way too close to home for me.
I agree that there are so very many factors that come into play here, but the reality is that half of this couple is done with the relationship. She just doesn’t know it yet.
When I was younger I lost all interest in sex with a boyfriend a couple of months before we broke up. I couldn’t explain it then but years later I recalled the very moment that I stopped trusting him which led to my big freeze.
I’m on the other side now. I often wonder how long it will be before she realizes she was done with us years ago.
i always thought of lube as a young person’s thing…i’ve never noticed old couples perusing the lube section. my friends and i joke about it, because it’s as basic to kinky sex to us as adult toy stores to us. i’m 22 and i’ve been using lube for quite a while myself. i have no problem admitting that to anyone.
I’m very familiar with the problem of a dry vagina. It started happening to my wife four years ago (we’re in our late 50′s) Lubes work very well. Vaginal moisturizers plus lubes are great. Dr. Barbara Keesling says that 60% of women over 40 have this problem.
Oral sex would be great of course, but my wife doesn’t like it. (If anyone has any ideas I could use to get her to reconsider I would be eternally grateful.)
As many contributers have pointed out, That’s not the real problem here. The relationship needs to be fixed.
.